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	<title>Comments on: 2011 Resolution &#8211; Call It &#8220;Pollution&#8221;</title>
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	<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/</link>
	<description>Dispatches from the Youth Climate Movement</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 26 Apr 2013 13:16:52 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Britain&#039;s Power</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95808</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Britain&#039;s Power]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Feb 2011 21:49:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95808</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] response to: 2011 Resolution – Call It &#8217;Pollution&#8216; Kyle [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] response to: 2011 Resolution – Call It &#8217;Pollution&#8216; Kyle [...]</p>
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		<title>By: KDCS</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95543</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[KDCS]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Jan 2011 00:29:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95543</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree - &quot;GHG pollution&quot; it is!  We need to make comments on blogs / news sites all over when they use &quot;emissions&quot; to (inadvertently) soften the blow.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree &#8211; &#8220;GHG pollution&#8221; it is!  We need to make comments on blogs / news sites all over when they use &#8220;emissions&#8221; to (inadvertently) soften the blow.</p>
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		<title>By: Scary New Year&#8217;s Resolutions for Our Air Agency in Southern California &#8211; Natural Resources Defense Council (blog)</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95512</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Scary New Year&#8217;s Resolutions for Our Air Agency in Southern California &#8211; Natural Resources Defense Council (blog)]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Jan 2011 16:13:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95512</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Pollution GuidelinesCRIENGLISH.comMedical News Today (press release)&#160;-Detroit Free Press&#160;-It&#8217;s Getting Hot In Hereall 13 news [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Pollution GuidelinesCRIENGLISH.comMedical News Today (press release)&nbsp;-Detroit Free Press&nbsp;-It&#8217;s Getting Hot In Hereall 13 news [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Ben West</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95494</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ben West]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Jan 2011 00:54:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95494</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[While I&#039;m all in favour of re-framing where it helps us to communicate our values more effectively, it would be a real mistake for us to assume (or to suggest) that CO2 emissions are a straightforward pollution problem like any other.

CO2 is patently different. It&#039;s invisible, odourless and non-toxic. Unlike the kind of noxious substances an ordinary person would consider &#039;pollution&#039;, it&#039;s not inherently bad. Our problems are not caused by CO2 itself, but rather by the quantity of CO2. If a diabetic dies from too much sugar, that doesn&#039;t make sugar a poison.

Similarly, the term &#039;pollution&#039; suggests a foreign substance sullying an otherwise pure and unspoilt environment. The effects of a chemical spill, for example, are very clealy seen within a specific geographical area, with the source of the pollution close-by. 

CO2 is different- it&#039;s distributed across our atmosphere, and the relationship between excessive CO2 emissions and its consequences is often far from obvious and separated by thousands of miles. 

You can&#039;t gloss over those differences- even your dumbest opponent knows that CO2 doesn&#039;t look or behave like pollution. That&#039;s where all this &#039;CO2 is plant food&#039; bull comes from- our attempts to patronise.

The author is definitely right in that we need to take another look at the conceptual underpinnings of what we&#039;re trying to do, as well as the language we use to describe those concepts. But re-branding CO2 as pollution seems to to me to be a blind alley.

I&#039;m more inclined to go with Nordhaus and Shellenger&#039;s analysis. In their excellent book &#039;Break through: from the death of environmentalism to the politics of possibility&#039;, they spend an entire chapter explaining why we need to get away from, not closer to, the pollution paradigm:
http://books.google.com/books?id=xNJtkLxTpekC&amp;lpg=PP1&amp;ots=aKQTbo-j6W&amp;dq=nordhaus%20environmentalism%20pollution%20emissions&amp;pg=PA113#v=snippet&amp;q=pollution%20paradigm&amp;f=false

What&#039;s needed is not a pollution paradigm that hinges on ideas of human restraint, of carbon counting and greenhouse gas reduction, because the truth is, it ain&#039;t ever going to sell outside of the middle class, let alone in China.

Instead, we need a story that speaks of human optimism and opportunity unleashed- one that calls for us to tap into humanity&#039;s endless resources of innovation, imagination and enterprise in order to abandon the failed solutions of the past and embrace the opportunities of the clean energy economy.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I&#8217;m all in favour of re-framing where it helps us to communicate our values more effectively, it would be a real mistake for us to assume (or to suggest) that CO2 emissions are a straightforward pollution problem like any other.</p>
<p>CO2 is patently different. It&#8217;s invisible, odourless and non-toxic. Unlike the kind of noxious substances an ordinary person would consider &#8216;pollution&#8217;, it&#8217;s not inherently bad. Our problems are not caused by CO2 itself, but rather by the quantity of CO2. If a diabetic dies from too much sugar, that doesn&#8217;t make sugar a poison.</p>
<p>Similarly, the term &#8216;pollution&#8217; suggests a foreign substance sullying an otherwise pure and unspoilt environment. The effects of a chemical spill, for example, are very clealy seen within a specific geographical area, with the source of the pollution close-by. </p>
<p>CO2 is different- it&#8217;s distributed across our atmosphere, and the relationship between excessive CO2 emissions and its consequences is often far from obvious and separated by thousands of miles. </p>
<p>You can&#8217;t gloss over those differences- even your dumbest opponent knows that CO2 doesn&#8217;t look or behave like pollution. That&#8217;s where all this &#8216;CO2 is plant food&#8217; bull comes from- our attempts to patronise.</p>
<p>The author is definitely right in that we need to take another look at the conceptual underpinnings of what we&#8217;re trying to do, as well as the language we use to describe those concepts. But re-branding CO2 as pollution seems to to me to be a blind alley.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m more inclined to go with Nordhaus and Shellenger&#8217;s analysis. In their excellent book &#8216;Break through: from the death of environmentalism to the politics of possibility&#8217;, they spend an entire chapter explaining why we need to get away from, not closer to, the pollution paradigm:<br />
<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=xNJtkLxTpekC&#038;lpg=PP1&#038;ots=aKQTbo-j6W&#038;dq=nordhaus%20environmentalism%20pollution%20emissions&#038;pg=PA113#v=snippet&#038;q=pollution%20paradigm&#038;f=false" rel="nofollow">http://books.google.com/books?id=xNJtkLxTpekC&#038;lpg=PP1&#038;ots=aKQTbo-j6W&#038;dq=nordhaus%20environmentalism%20pollution%20emissions&#038;pg=PA113#v=snippet&#038;q=pollution%20paradigm&#038;f=false</a></p>
<p>What&#8217;s needed is not a pollution paradigm that hinges on ideas of human restraint, of carbon counting and greenhouse gas reduction, because the truth is, it ain&#8217;t ever going to sell outside of the middle class, let alone in China.</p>
<p>Instead, we need a story that speaks of human optimism and opportunity unleashed- one that calls for us to tap into humanity&#8217;s endless resources of innovation, imagination and enterprise in order to abandon the failed solutions of the past and embrace the opportunities of the clean energy economy.</p>
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		<title>By: Lea Lupkin</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95480</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lea Lupkin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2011 21:38:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95480</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hear, hear! That&#039;s my new resolution.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hear, hear! That&#8217;s my new resolution.</p>
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		<title>By: Adolf Goreing</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95476</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Adolf Goreing]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2011 18:01:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95476</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I´m not sure the plants agree with you. It´s like preventing them of having their food. Ask yourself why real Greenhouses have a CO2 level three times the level of the atmosphere. Is it to melt the glaciers otherwise found there? (this message was sponsored by Exxon, NOT)

Seriously, there are more and more scientific evidence pointing to other directions than CO2. It is already possible to explain many of the most critical climate criteria without always using CO2 as a climate driver.

Take a look at these late scientific references. They are written by people outside &quot;the AGW rescure team&quot; (i.e Hansen,Jonea,Santer, Mann, Annan, Schmidt et al.) and are both putting CO2 in the periphery. It is not a dominant factor at all.

http://www.scirp.org/Journal/PaperDownload.aspx?FileName=NS20101100004_10739704.pdf&amp;paperID=3217

http://www.scirp.org/Journal/PaperInformation.aspx?paperID=3447&amp;utm_source=newsletter&amp;utm_medium=ijg13&amp;utm_campaign=01]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I´m not sure the plants agree with you. It´s like preventing them of having their food. Ask yourself why real Greenhouses have a CO2 level three times the level of the atmosphere. Is it to melt the glaciers otherwise found there? (this message was sponsored by Exxon, NOT)</p>
<p>Seriously, there are more and more scientific evidence pointing to other directions than CO2. It is already possible to explain many of the most critical climate criteria without always using CO2 as a climate driver.</p>
<p>Take a look at these late scientific references. They are written by people outside &#8220;the AGW rescure team&#8221; (i.e Hansen,Jonea,Santer, Mann, Annan, Schmidt et al.) and are both putting CO2 in the periphery. It is not a dominant factor at all.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.scirp.org/Journal/PaperDownload.aspx?FileName=NS20101100004_10739704.pdf&#038;paperID=3217" rel="nofollow">http://www.scirp.org/Journal/PaperDownload.aspx?FileName=NS20101100004_10739704.pdf&#038;paperID=3217</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.scirp.org/Journal/PaperInformation.aspx?paperID=3447&#038;utm_source=newsletter&#038;utm_medium=ijg13&#038;utm_campaign=01" rel="nofollow">http://www.scirp.org/Journal/PaperInformation.aspx?paperID=3447&#038;utm_source=newsletter&#038;utm_medium=ijg13&#038;utm_campaign=01</a></p>
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		<title>By: James P. Kelly</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95475</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[James P. Kelly]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2011 17:59:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95475</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree %1000! The difference between &quot;emissions&quot; and &quot;pollution&quot; is the difference between an unfortunate &#039;fact of modern life&#039; and a &#039;self-destructive and toxic choice&#039; that human continue to make for short-term convenience regardless of the disastrous consequences we refuse to face. Westen et.al., of Emery University published an excellent study that explores the psychological games we play with truth: http://bit.ly/cCRoSO Westen D, Blagov PS, Harenski K, Kilts C, Hamann S., Neural bases of motivated reasoning Journal of Cognitive Neuroscience. 11/06;18(11):1947-58.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree %1000! The difference between &#8220;emissions&#8221; and &#8220;pollution&#8221; is the difference between an unfortunate &#8216;fact of modern life&#8217; and a &#8216;self-destructive and toxic choice&#8217; that human continue to make for short-term convenience regardless of the disastrous consequences we refuse to face. Westen et.al., of Emery University published an excellent study that explores the psychological games we play with truth: <a href="http://bit.ly/cCRoSO" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/cCRoSO</a> Westen D, Blagov PS, Harenski K, Kilts C, Hamann S., Neural bases of motivated reasoning Journal of Cognitive Neuroscience. 11/06;18(11):1947-58.</p>
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		<title>By: S.E. Hendriksen</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95473</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[S.E. Hendriksen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2011 17:14:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95473</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[All the GHG pollution will before or later becomming &#039;Pollution sink&#039; and disappear in the oceans]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All the GHG pollution will before or later becomming &#8216;Pollution sink&#8217; and disappear in the oceans</p>
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		<title>By: Kym</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95472</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kym]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2011 15:34:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95472</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This is one resolution I can keep!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is one resolution I can keep!</p>
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		<title>By: djrabbit</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2011/01/03/2011-resolution-call-it-pollution/#comment-95458</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[djrabbit]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2011 05:12:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/?p=22113#comment-95458</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Actually, it&#039;s not just good messaging. It&#039;s the law. Just ask the Supreme Court and the federal government (EPA), both of which now agree that emitting fossilized carbon into the biosphere is &quot;air pollution&quot; as defined under the Clean Air Act.

That&#039;s what the EPA&#039;s GHG endangerment finding was all about. Fossil-based GHG emissions are now officially &quot;pollution&quot;.

The caveat is that not all GHGs are pollution, for example it&#039;s not &quot;pollution&quot; for you to exhale. But in the most-common context, that of industrial, commercial, or residential emissions, &quot;GHG pollution&quot; is the best descriptor.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, it&#8217;s not just good messaging. It&#8217;s the law. Just ask the Supreme Court and the federal government (EPA), both of which now agree that emitting fossilized carbon into the biosphere is &#8220;air pollution&#8221; as defined under the Clean Air Act.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s what the EPA&#8217;s GHG endangerment finding was all about. Fossil-based GHG emissions are now officially &#8220;pollution&#8221;.</p>
<p>The caveat is that not all GHGs are pollution, for example it&#8217;s not &#8220;pollution&#8221; for you to exhale. But in the most-common context, that of industrial, commercial, or residential emissions, &#8220;GHG pollution&#8221; is the best descriptor.</p>
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