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	<title>Comments on: The Party Crashers</title>
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	<description>Dispatches from the Youth Climate Movement</description>
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		<title>By: Positive Vibes at the RNC &#171; It&#8217;s Getting Hot In Here</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2008/08/22/the-party-crashers/#comment-67556</link>
		<dc:creator>Positive Vibes at the RNC &#171; It&#8217;s Getting Hot In Here</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 04:10:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.wordpress.com/?p=5437#comment-67556</guid>
		<description>[...] response to Josh’s post last week on the Republican National Convention, Willie makes the point that while the conventions draw an [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] response to Josh’s post last week on the Republican National Convention, Willie makes the point that while the conventions draw an [...]</p>
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		<title>By: joshuakahnrussell</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2008/08/22/the-party-crashers/#comment-67365</link>
		<dc:creator>joshuakahnrussell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 16:32:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.wordpress.com/?p=5437#comment-67365</guid>
		<description>Hey Kai, 

I actually think we mostly agree here. My point wasn&#039;t that expressive or symbolic protest is bad or wrong, just that there is a new strategic opening that I think activists could engage more. The 2004 RNC demonstrations actually were very thoughtfully messaged but largely didn&#039;t accomplish the kinds of cultural shifts that they set out to do, for a number of reasons that probably aren&#039;t relevant to go into now. If the RNC protests this year had a clear message that was engaging Obama&#039;s narrative that &quot;we are writing a new chapter in the American story&quot; it could be a moment where otherwise marginal fringe activists can inspire and lead this country forward. It could put issues like climate change more center stage on the debate floor. The urgency of the climate crisis is pushing organizing and environmental issues from margin to center of American politics, and that&#039;s an exciting thing that longtime activists have a chance to be a part of and influence, rather than alienate. Even though it doesn&#039;t seem like that will happen this round of conventions, I do agree that creative mobilizations can definitely be fun (for some folks) and Funk the War, for example, has been an injection of positive energy into the antiwar movement, for sure. I&#039;m excited about high-energy creative tactics that serve to help a movement stay interesting and enjoyable. But I&#039;m sure you&#039;d agree that simply &#039;loving what you&#039; do is not the best criteria upon which to base social movement strategy. My post wasn&#039;t to disparage anyone from doing what they do best, but just trying to spark some thought and circulate The Nation piece.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Kai, </p>
<p>I actually think we mostly agree here. My point wasn&#8217;t that expressive or symbolic protest is bad or wrong, just that there is a new strategic opening that I think activists could engage more. The 2004 RNC demonstrations actually were very thoughtfully messaged but largely didn&#8217;t accomplish the kinds of cultural shifts that they set out to do, for a number of reasons that probably aren&#8217;t relevant to go into now. If the RNC protests this year had a clear message that was engaging Obama&#8217;s narrative that &#8220;we are writing a new chapter in the American story&#8221; it could be a moment where otherwise marginal fringe activists can inspire and lead this country forward. It could put issues like climate change more center stage on the debate floor. The urgency of the climate crisis is pushing organizing and environmental issues from margin to center of American politics, and that&#8217;s an exciting thing that longtime activists have a chance to be a part of and influence, rather than alienate. Even though it doesn&#8217;t seem like that will happen this round of conventions, I do agree that creative mobilizations can definitely be fun (for some folks) and Funk the War, for example, has been an injection of positive energy into the antiwar movement, for sure. I&#8217;m excited about high-energy creative tactics that serve to help a movement stay interesting and enjoyable. But I&#8217;m sure you&#8217;d agree that simply &#8216;loving what you&#8217; do is not the best criteria upon which to base social movement strategy. My post wasn&#8217;t to disparage anyone from doing what they do best, but just trying to spark some thought and circulate The Nation piece.</p>
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		<title>By: willie</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2008/08/22/the-party-crashers/#comment-67351</link>
		<dc:creator>willie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 01:38:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.wordpress.com/?p=5437#comment-67351</guid>
		<description>great post josh, and good points kai.

i personally don&#039;t see the strategy of the big demos at the conventions. it would be one thing if they were going to shut them down but the cops and homeland security and who knows what other law enforcement types know the drill and they have more resources. it sometimes seems like a pitched battle to me. and there is something to be said for forcing the heavy hand of the state. it just points out the power that we do have. they have to do these crazy unconstitutional mass arrests to prevent the people from rising and physically preventing the Conventions from occuring. that&#039;s at least interesting. I do however agree with Kai in as much as if people like it then go for it. But at the same time i feel like the mostly younger, mostly more direct-action oriented folks who are drawn to this type of thing might have a  bigger impact if they ignored the big spectacle of the DNC and instead went to support Road Block Earth First! in Indiana who are fighting like hell to keep Interstate 69 from cutting through their communities and enabling NAFTA&#039;s exploitation of south and central america. Or maybe these folks could shut down Bank of Americas and Citis for their financing of the coal industry. Or shut down some recruiting offices or military weapons plants.

The elections are a big stupid circus. But everyone&#039;s paying attention to them so exploit that to get a message out, sure. In that sense the anarchistic street protests of the DNC and RNC are strategically similar to the much more reformist and well-behaved Power Vote project. But as a direct-action oriented individual myself I feel like any affective action we take can provide our message to the media and thus the public discourse. Banks and other investors, the military, the Indiana Department of Transportation - there are tons of pieces of infrastructure that are absolutely necessary to the destructive and exploitative operations of the corporate-state machine. The beautiful thing is that they are also absolutely vulnerable to a few people stepping outside of our prescribed behavior just a little bit and really causing our oppressors some problems. 

To all my friends who will be going to the DNC and RNC to try to shake things up, I thank you and support you. You&#039;ve got your own strategies and philosophies that I don&#039;t fully understand. And to Power Vote please keep these people you&#039;re roping in engaged after the elections and counsel them as they come to understand that voting just plain ain&#039;t gonna cut it. Help them develop a more radical analysis. Help them learn more direct tactics. And hey radicals - be patient. If someone is getting active and it&#039;s in some reformist way that you&#039;re not feeling then don&#039;t dis them for being naive. Focus on encouraging and appreciating not so much what they&#039;re doing but that they&#039;re doing something. Make spaces for conversations in which disagreements can be discussed respectfully. This will do more to radicalize folks than being mean to them ever will.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>great post josh, and good points kai.</p>
<p>i personally don&#8217;t see the strategy of the big demos at the conventions. it would be one thing if they were going to shut them down but the cops and homeland security and who knows what other law enforcement types know the drill and they have more resources. it sometimes seems like a pitched battle to me. and there is something to be said for forcing the heavy hand of the state. it just points out the power that we do have. they have to do these crazy unconstitutional mass arrests to prevent the people from rising and physically preventing the Conventions from occuring. that&#8217;s at least interesting. I do however agree with Kai in as much as if people like it then go for it. But at the same time i feel like the mostly younger, mostly more direct-action oriented folks who are drawn to this type of thing might have a  bigger impact if they ignored the big spectacle of the DNC and instead went to support Road Block Earth First! in Indiana who are fighting like hell to keep Interstate 69 from cutting through their communities and enabling NAFTA&#8217;s exploitation of south and central america. Or maybe these folks could shut down Bank of Americas and Citis for their financing of the coal industry. Or shut down some recruiting offices or military weapons plants.</p>
<p>The elections are a big stupid circus. But everyone&#8217;s paying attention to them so exploit that to get a message out, sure. In that sense the anarchistic street protests of the DNC and RNC are strategically similar to the much more reformist and well-behaved Power Vote project. But as a direct-action oriented individual myself I feel like any affective action we take can provide our message to the media and thus the public discourse. Banks and other investors, the military, the Indiana Department of Transportation &#8211; there are tons of pieces of infrastructure that are absolutely necessary to the destructive and exploitative operations of the corporate-state machine. The beautiful thing is that they are also absolutely vulnerable to a few people stepping outside of our prescribed behavior just a little bit and really causing our oppressors some problems. </p>
<p>To all my friends who will be going to the DNC and RNC to try to shake things up, I thank you and support you. You&#8217;ve got your own strategies and philosophies that I don&#8217;t fully understand. And to Power Vote please keep these people you&#8217;re roping in engaged after the elections and counsel them as they come to understand that voting just plain ain&#8217;t gonna cut it. Help them develop a more radical analysis. Help them learn more direct tactics. And hey radicals &#8211; be patient. If someone is getting active and it&#8217;s in some reformist way that you&#8217;re not feeling then don&#8217;t dis them for being naive. Focus on encouraging and appreciating not so much what they&#8217;re doing but that they&#8217;re doing something. Make spaces for conversations in which disagreements can be discussed respectfully. This will do more to radicalize folks than being mean to them ever will.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Kai Bosworth</title>
		<link>http://itsgettinghotinhere.org/2008/08/22/the-party-crashers/#comment-67350</link>
		<dc:creator>Kai Bosworth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 00:26:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itsgettinghotinhere.wordpress.com/?p=5437#comment-67350</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not really sure what you&#039;re getting at with the critique of the 2004 protest...You got arrested for a non-crime, and felt embarrassed (what the oppressor/authority wanted you to feel) despite the fact you did nothing wrong. I&#039;m assuming (although I could be wrong) that the reactions of your fellow activists of pride were part of the plan to make the oppressors/authority feel uncomfortable or cheated rather than give the authority the satisfaction of demoralizing another activist.

Despite the fact that I don&#039;t always agree with the messaging or tactics used by my fellow activists here in St. Paul, I find it extremely difficult to find any fault in what will happen here. Both symbolic protests (like the big march, the awesome Funk the War dance party protest, and the insanely huge critical mass) and direct actions (we&#039;ll see what happens) can be useful and fun. These kids love what they&#039;re doing as much as I love community organizing, and I&#039;m personally OK with that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not really sure what you&#8217;re getting at with the critique of the 2004 protest&#8230;You got arrested for a non-crime, and felt embarrassed (what the oppressor/authority wanted you to feel) despite the fact you did nothing wrong. I&#8217;m assuming (although I could be wrong) that the reactions of your fellow activists of pride were part of the plan to make the oppressors/authority feel uncomfortable or cheated rather than give the authority the satisfaction of demoralizing another activist.</p>
<p>Despite the fact that I don&#8217;t always agree with the messaging or tactics used by my fellow activists here in St. Paul, I find it extremely difficult to find any fault in what will happen here. Both symbolic protests (like the big march, the awesome Funk the War dance party protest, and the insanely huge critical mass) and direct actions (we&#8217;ll see what happens) can be useful and fun. These kids love what they&#8217;re doing as much as I love community organizing, and I&#8217;m personally OK with that.</p>
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